stephenbrooks.orgForumMuon1GeneralCrunching for nothing possible?
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[SG]Santas little helper
2004-10-27 10:29:11
There is the question whether the accelerator will be build just if the efficiency has reached a specific minimum percentage or will it be build with the best percentage we calculate untill then? 
So, is it possible that we crunch for nothing if it is just not efficient enough?

[SG]Santas little helper
Stephen Brooks
2004-10-27 13:15:54
If it gets built, it will be with the best design that we have, obviously.  There is a lower limit on the performance it would need to be built, but it depends on more things than just the sections we are optimising.  There is also the possibility of other designs being tested via this network in the future, which may be better than the current ones.
tenfiveoh
2004-10-27 23:50:08
I see it as just the risk you take when experimenting with design options rather than crunching hard data like SETI or Find-a-drug.

This project may not come to fruition (I know this will get me beat up), but think about all the CPU hrs spent on the SETI project.  How frustrated are those users going to be when it's finally admitted they're not going to hear an alien signal & pull the plug?
Stephen Brooks
2004-10-28 07:03:45
I also personally see this project as developing into a tool that can be used in a range of accelerator design problems (and for the optimiser, _any_ engineering+simulation design problem), so the neutrino factory example is a proving ground in which over the next few years (2004-2007 is the timescale of my DPhil thesis, for instance) I'm hoping to demonstrate this technique can be powerful in that sort of real-world setup.
[SG]Santas little helper
2004-10-28 08:37:56
@tenfiveoh ...

I wouldn't be sad if the final result would be that the work was for nothing.  I enjoy crunching itself Smile (... but it would be more usefull for the questions the physicists want to answer with this project when we find a good design ...)

@Stephen: A further question could be whether the project is running just until the apparatus will be build or is an future optimisation of the machines (2007 onwards) possible/wise?

[SG]Santas little helper
kitsura
2004-10-28 08:53:28
Stephen: will any of the other designs you mentioned be implemented in v5?  I know lots of members who have left or stopped crunching because they felt that they weren't doing any useful work.
[OCAU] badger
2004-10-28 17:21:33
quote:
Originally posted by Stephen Brooks:
(2004-2007 is the timescale of my DPhil thesis, for instance)


Am I to take this as you assuming your PhD will only take 3 years?  If so good luck, I was lucky to get mine done in 4.5 years...
[SG]Santas little helper
2004-10-29 12:18:45
Imagine that from 1.1.2004 - 31.12.2007 it is nearly 4 years ...
Stephen Brooks
2004-10-30 06:38:07
quote:
Originally posted by kitsura:
Stephen: will any of the other designs you mentioned be implemented in v5?  I know lots of members who have left or stopped crunching because they felt that they weren't doing any useful work. 
Yes.  v5 will certainly be able to simulate a greater variety of components and there are already a design or two available that I'd like to optimise around.
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